If it's not really about tuning or wiring. Then it belongs in here.
I am thinking of building my new drift car soon.
Engine might be:
1- Toyotas's 2JZ
2- BMW's M3 S54
3- BMW's M50B25
Is it possible that you provide me with all the necessary details regarding building or upgrading the engine ( engine parts) along with all the required side parts (turbo, inter-cooler, BOV., etc...) so that i could build a drift car reaching 600-800 HorsePower ???
I don't know much about the BMW engines but the JZ is what I'm involved in with the drift cars I work on.
6-800 bhp is a wide power range, firstly you'll need to decide, 600, 700 or 800.
What fuel will you be running?
What ambient temperatures will the car be running in?
What budget do you have?
Last year I installed an ECU in a Toyota Supra which went on to produce over 1000bhp at the hubs.
I've built many Nissan engines, a few Toyota, an 2,3 BMW. What i've seen BMW are well engineered engines from the factory, but a full blown race engine is definitivly more expensive to built. While you can get highend engine parts for a JZ from like 20+ different manufacturers, there are only a few for BMW and this are expensive. If you are do something special you can get to a point, where you have to engineer your own parts for BMW engines.
VAC-Motorsport in the US does quit exiting BMW stuff.
So you are proposing that i go with the Toyota 2JZ engine. Comparing the performance between the BMW(M3) and the Toyota(2JZ) engines, which one do you think is more reliable and less possible to defect and cause detonation ? In addition to providing very high horsepower.
1- Fuel choice: Not really familiar with fuel types, hope you can suggest some.
2- Ambient temperature: 20-30 degrees celsius
3- Budget: Lets say say 10-15K $
For the ECU, i was thinking that the Link ECU's are really good for such an engine. What do you guys think?
The 2JZGTE engine is extremely reliable. The bottom ends have been known to handle 900 wheel horsepower without bending a rod or losing a bearing.
Detonation is caused by your fuel mixture, ignition setup, and tune. Either engine can be subject to detonation if not tuned properly.
Fuel choice: E85/Ethanol is definitely a more preferred method of fueling when it comes to making/building a high horsepower car. The alcohol contained within E85 helps to keep your cylinder cooler and reduce knock/detonation far better than a basic pump gas octane fuel. The only downside to E85 is that you need to get alcohol/ethanol compatible parts for your entire fuel system as the alcohol traits can cause damage to otherwise OEM parts meant for pump gas, such as your fuel filter, injectors, etc.
If you would like to make big power, the only realistic way to go is with a standalone engine management system, such as a Haltech, AEM EMS, or Megasquirt.
Ok will keep that in mind.
So can you give me the whole recipe regarding the engine upgrades (rods, bearings, cams, crankshaft, pistons, etc...) to reach 800HP for example.
Isnt the Link ECU good for this type of projects? I can see many successful drift cars running with the Link ECU, and making it to the max.
What do you think about that?
The link ECU s are great for the drift cars, that's what I use most of the time.
Titan stage 3 head, 282 cams, cp pistons, tomi rods, acl bearings and rap studs through out, get the crank balanced properly.
ID1300cc injectors, overkill for pump gas but essential for race fuels due to their stainless internal construction.
Turbo choice, Garrett GT40 kind of size
Manifolds, inlet go for hyper tune, exhaust look into 6boost.
Fuel system, Aeromotive do some more than capable fuel pumps.
ECU is an open market, link, vipec, MoTeC, life racing, Syvecs, aem, Caltech, Tec etc
So this would be a good mixture to handle really high HP(700-800).
Do you have any idea about the overall price of these parts?
This is roughly the spec of the 1000+hub hp supra I worked on last year. They ran about 800 in competition
Chris250 can i please have your contact email address ?
Yes, link g4+ are great ECU. Power of a Motec M hundres series, with halve the price tag. Since the last firmware updated, Flexfuel cababilieties and fuel calculation model is even better. Traction controll, and many other motorsport additions will come with the next update in few weeks.
I worked with over 20 different ECU brands and found link the easiest and most hassle free ECU too work with. Ecu is better documented then any other and you have to use only one software for Logging and ECU analysis. Most other manufacturers have two separate software for Logging and Tuning, which is not really handy and more time consuming.
Other ECU's that i can recommend:
-Vipec > same as link, but with all upgrates enabled from factory
-Motec witout doubt, an industrie leader (with big price tag)
- Haltech overall nice and userfriendly ECU's
- Syvecs/ life racing > very advanced ECU which are used in Le mans cars lmp1,lmp2. Unfortunately the software looks like a nightmare. Not to be recommended for beginners!
As already mentioned by others, the 2JZ is probably your cheapest/easiest option for reliable power. While you can go overboard on upgrading the engine, we've actually found them to be incredibly reliable with only external bolt on parts. We had a car across the dyno a couple of weeks back which made 710 whp at 28 psi boost on E85 with a stock long motor and a Borg Warner S300 turbo. The only thing holding it back was a misfire at high boost.
If you want to ensure reliability i would only worry about pistons, rods and a decent head gasket with head studs. Cams, valves, porting etc are all options but depending on your turbo spec they aren't strictly necessary for your goals.
The 2JZ isn't a sophisticated engine by modern standards and any modern quality ECU will be more than capable - Haltech, Link/Vipec, Motec hundred series or M1 etc.
Agreed, a 2JZGTE's long block does not need to be modified to make 600-700 WHP. The pistons/rods/bearings from the factory (even on used engines) can take the beating/torque at that kind of horsepower level. To assist in making that kind of power with ease, increasing the intake/exhaust flow by using more aggressive cam profiles (don't forget to match them with your specific turbo setup) and porting the head help tremendously.
Andre - Sorry to get off topic, but did that specific setup have a coil on plug ignition conversion? The GM coils work great for ignition break-up at those power levels, as I'm sure you are already aware (The Mojo COP kit makes that conversion as easy as possible).
The mojo kit is great, approx 40kv output that's nearly as much as cdi systems.
If you want to get in touch outside of the forum Hanieid then contact me through my business site dyna tune dot co dot UK.
If it's questions others could benefit from I'd prefer it was kept on here to increase the knowledge base, no offence
@2JayZeeFTW Yes the one I was referencing did have upgraded coils. They were a 'coil near plug' setup using high energy inductive coils. I also needed to correct my earler post as I was reminded that the head was fitted with a set of mild cams. Still impressive results any way you slice it.