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Looking for some information on these as i have read a lot of conflicting information on them some good some bad(no support from them unless spending alot of money/wont control a rotary out of the box/ can be difficult to use)
reason i ask is i have seen a good deal on one and i am considering this instead of a syvecs s8/s12
Pectel (now Cosworth) is a very powerful ECU but sadly I'd also say that they are designed more for professional motorsport use and are not the most intuitive platform I've come across. That being said, Life Racing was born out of Pectel and Syvecs is a Life Racing ECU with Syvecs specific firmware so the look and feel of the Syvecs and Pectel are very similar. I only raise this because you're considering the Syvecs as an alternative. I can't speak about the support you're likely to get from Pectel/Cosworth unfortunately as I haven't used their systems enough to need support.
I think I'll have a good think about it before I do anything
Pectel sq6m and colour dash for the same price as a syvecs s12 is hard to look past
I work for Cosworth and run an SQ6 in my own car.
Happy to help with any queries you have.
As Andre said, Pectel was the original with Life, then Syvecs coming after. Similar hardware but pro's and con's of each system.
There is a lot of info on the internet saying Cosworth only deal with the big OEM's/Series, whilst this is the majority of our business, is not the case and we still support individual users either directly or through our dealers.
If you've been offered the Colour dash (i assume ICD?) its a no brainier, the power of the dash alone is monumental when compared to others on the market and when combined with the ECU.
Software wise, LifeCal/Scal started as our older software DescPro, we now have CalTool which in my opinion has some key advantages; this however is a bit different to the older softwares, but you will pick it up relatively quickly.
You can ask on here or email me on email@example.com with any other questions you may have.
Hi Rob, thanks for your additions to this thread. Great to know we have someone from inside Cosworth on here!
that is absolutely brilliant to hear and has given me some piece of mind, can you confirm is there any special software to be purchased in order to run a 4 rotor rotary engine?
yes the dash is the icd colour dash
thanks for taking the time to help with my questions
Having been an ex Pectel/Cosworth customer it is pretty fair to say that the company used to only be interested in big clients, as an individual they were quite difficult to deal with. You were very reliant on your dealer for support and if the one you were unfortunate to choose was not very good, you were a bit stuck.
Recently it looks like the company has made great strides to improve it's customer service for individuals. The support forum and site is now pretty good with lots of useful information, downloads and quick responses to posts. In addition there are now some pretty good dealers out there with helpful, knowledgeable staff who are just as interested in the individual as teams and race series, Race Data Systems are one in the UK are one I would recommend.
As for the system itself, the ECU software is simple but perhaps not as pretty as its competitors, I have not tried the latest versions so it has probably improved further. It has all the features you probably need and is pretty easy to learn. The data logging analysis software is really good, even when just using the free version.
I still rate Motec higher than Cosworth for an individual, but the gap is now much closer than it has ever been. If I was choosing my ECU/dash package the decision with who to go to would now be a lot harder. I certainly wouldn't be concerned about going back to Cosworth in future.
I looked at Syvecs previously. Seemed OK but in my situation Motec were cheaper for a product set that looked easier to use.
No problem! I see you've done some Cosworth related tech talks recently so feel free to fire me a message if you need any extra info on things. You'll have Milan's details after Goodwood too who is a very good guy.
Jonathan, ok so i was wondering if you did actually have a rotary or whether you were just pointing out what you've seen online. Short answer is, technically yes, it can be done, but not immediately setup for it in a 'easy' way. Id say itll be easier to email me direct to discuss the options. Would you be tuning it yourself or appointing someone to do it?
If you do go another ECU route, you should still try and get the dash. Power with its CAN / Maths and analysis software is a step ahead of the rest.
The SQ6 doesnt support rotaries as far as I know - at least I have never seen a dataset/metafile with 1080 deg or even 360/2 stroke cycle support and I havent seen one with any strategy for leading/trailing ignition spilt.
LR/Syvecs can do 360deg cycle with leading/trailing split (they call it secondary ignition). Proper rotary support would use a 1080deg cycle but as far as I can think using 360 will work fine for most things except you wouldnt want to use fuel cut limiters or vastly different injector timing between primary/secondary injectors.
I have a dataset off a running 3 rotor car, it has been done, just not many as it’s not immediately obvious how to do it in the software. I will admit though there will be other ECU’s on the market better setup for it.
Hi Rob, would you be willing to share that file so I could take a look (I look after a few local cars with SQ6's and have one I use on my own car at times) - even if you zero out all the tables so you are not giving away any "IP". I want to see if there is any leading trailing split facility or if they are just firing the plugs at same time (can work ok on PP NA rotary, but will probably leave a lot of power on the table especially if turbo).
@Adam, interesting comment re the trailing split. In my own experience I've seen very minimal difference in power/torque regardless of split. All the information I've ever read on the subject points to the trailing plug being primarily for emissions purposes rather than power.
@Andre, I havent done many rotaries and most that I have done up until recently were pretty basic cars so I didnt mess with trailing ign too much - just wacked something like 10deg split in and tuned it like normal and everything seemed happy.
A few months ago though I tuned one for a friend that wanted as good drivability as possible and I had it for a few weeks to play with in my spare time. I messed around with ign timing, trailing split and injector timing quite a bit. It was nothing wild, reasonably big ports from what I could see from the outside, unknown chinese "T04" turbo, unknown compression ratio, made a bit over 400WHP @ 16psi which was the most boost the hardware could do (assume wastegate was pushing open).
On this car it liked the trailing split around 12deg best, I could reach MBT timing on 98 pump gas pretty much everywhere. Bringing the leading/trailing closer didnt makes much difference in power down to about 8deg split but had to pull a couple of degs advance out as it was giving hints of knock. However, once I got down to 5deg split I had to pull about 7 deg timing out and power was down about 30HP. I didnt go any lower in split as it was obvious I was going backwards. Im not sure if this is typical or something unique to this car but I can only assume when they are too close you get a flame front from each plug colliding just at the wrong time.
I can echo that on under load on a boosted setup 10-15 yields best results reaching MBT, on an NA setup Ive yet to see any significant power gains increasing or decreasing split from 0-15*.
On a side note the RX8 and subsequently myself and I'm sure few (read: a boatload) other folks started shooting for negative split under very light load and have seen a marked increase in drivability on street applications.
Don't Rice Racing in Aus use them on rotaries?
Rice racing is a Syvecs dealer. As far as im aware he only does Syvecs ecus, not Pectel
Was defo using MQ12 at one point.